Curse

Esan · Apr 24, 2008, 01:48 PM // 13:48

Quote:

Originally Posted by fenix

you [...] got hacked because of the trojans you actually downloaded

Generally, AutoHotkey or AutoIt "macros" (there is no functional difference between a macro and any other kind of program, despite what Gaile and others seem to think) are distributed in source form, which you should read before running. If all they do is click the mouse and press keyboard keys, they are unlikely to be trojans.

Anyhow, the HFFF run is simple enough that you can write your own bot, even with the programming you learned in your high school computer classes.

Now, I do think that the GW client should detect (if it doesn't already) that it is getting synthetic events from another program, and report that automatically. The server can easily filter for reports that happen in Melandru's Hope to detect the HFFF bots. If Anet really wanted to end the scourge of HFFF bots, they could have it done by tomorrow. They probably don't think it is important to crack down on HFFF botting, or they fear a backlash from the players if they ban hundreds. I wonder why the RMT companies haven't gotten wind of this easy money yet -- maybe they will, and finally get Anet's attention.

Washi · Apr 24, 2008, 01:56 PM // 13:56

Quote:

Originally Posted by Esan

Feel free to bot in Lutgardis because Anet have proven by their actions that they will not ban HFFF bots. I reported them until I got blue in the face, but no action was taken against them.

That's BS. My 30 month old account was banned cause some trigger happy GM thought I was a bot. No evidence, nothing, he didn't even PM me to check if I was there.

But after I bought another copy of GW I still see the same bots hitting a post in Lutgardis so you can always try...

Lycan Nibbler · Apr 25, 2008, 06:32 AM // 06:32

Quote:

Originally Posted by fgarvin

Why in the hell would you report someone for doing something that does not affect you in ANY way? Do you call the Police every time you see someone speeding, or not using their turn signals properly? If you happen to have any siblings, I feel sorry for them...you prolly go running to mommy every time you see them doing something against the rules.

It effects EVERYONE in the game. I have seen KING and DU guilds literally earn MILLIONs in gold a day from running bots in Korea, Russia, Polish and other districts. I did it the hard way (well if there is a hard way to HFF) and I dont want to see all the excess cash coming into the game inflating high end prices and I certainly dont want to see someone earning it afk because they have a keyboard they can use a macro on.

Xunlai Secret Agent · Apr 25, 2008, 09:45 AM // 09:45

"Millions"

150g per run from quest. ~100g from Amber for each 1,000 faction. So about 190g per run, assuming they aren't rushing for the title and donating it. Assuming a 2 minute turnover, you get 5.7k per hour. Even if you run the bot for a full 24 hours, and no glitches occur, you get only 136.8k per day. That is ~957k in a week of botting... as in 168 straight hours.

Also, you should take a look at the code on some of those public bots some day.

Code:

While 1
Exit()
WEnd

I found that gem on such a HFFF bot, and laughed my ass off, then deleted the source off my computer.

Fair warning, whoever writes those bots isn't the most competent programmer you could ever get.

---

On another note, I seem to remember Guild Wars: Prophecies being marketed to me as a grind-less game for the casual gamer when I bought it. Now, we have skills linked to rep grinds that require about 2 weeks of continuous farming to max out. What is this, WoW?

I'm having a really hard time disliking anyone who decides to run a HFFF bot, or admiring anyone who decides to spend their time reporting them.

Esan · Apr 25, 2008, 12:09 PM // 12:09

Quote:

Originally Posted by Xunlai Secret Agent

On another note, I seem to remember Guild Wars: Prophecies being marketed to me as a grind-less game for the casual gamer when I bought it. Now, we have skills linked to rep grinds that require about 2 weeks of continuous farming to max out.

If you notice, these PvE skills are not in Prophecies. The game changed between Proph and Factions. Factions, Nightfall and EotN did not carry any idealistic "skill > time" proclamations.

Ulterion · Apr 25, 2008, 03:59 PM // 15:59

Quote:

Originally Posted by Xunlai Secret Agent

I'm having a really hard time disliking anyone who decides to run a HFFF bot, or admiring anyone who decides to spend their time reporting them.

I couldn't agree with you more! Botters don't affect me. Pre-Teens and below are typically the only ones that whine about anything and everything while the adults just pay it no mind. /report = ftl.

Furthermore, Allegiance Titles are a waste of time & life, anyway... imho

Kashrlyyk · Apr 25, 2008, 04:06 PM // 16:06

Quote:

Originally Posted by Xunlai Secret Agent

"Millions"

150g per run from quest. ~100g from Amber for each 1,000 faction. So about 190g per run, assuming they aren't rushing for the title and donating it. Assuming a 2 minute turnover, you get 5.7k per hour. Even if you run the bot for a full 24 hours, and no glitches occur, you get only 136.8k per day. That is ~957k in a week of botting... as in 168 straight hours.
....

He didn´t say, one person earns millions a day. He stated "guilds" do. With 136k per bot and day, that is very much possible.

Ekelon · Apr 25, 2008, 05:42 PM // 17:42

More HFFF controversy... Well, I'm 1/8 of the way to my max kurzick title (only half of it was from HFFF, AB is still mega fun), but I took a break, might start up again soon. I usually watch a movie when I HFFF, because it requires you do have your screen on and doing something with it every 10 seconds, so you can't really alt+tab and still be efficient. I can really understand why people who don't bot are accused of it. When you do something for hours on end, you'll probably end up multi-tasking (like watching TV). I stopped chatting because I found that my efficiency rate was cut in half as I would often just stop what I was doing and start talking.

On my YouTube page there is a link to my HFFF Kurzick guide.
http:///www.youtube.com/ekelon123

Xunlai Secret Agent · Apr 25, 2008, 06:21 PM // 18:21

Quote:

Originally Posted by Kashrlyyk

He didn´t say, one person earns millions a day. He stated "guilds" do. With 136k per bot and day, that is very much possible.

I can not imagine even bot farms run a specific bot 24 hours a day.

Furthermore, you do not do HFFF botting for gold. 5.7k / hour is terrible. Writing a bot to farm Elona's Reach or HM Archers should easily be obtainable for someone with only a basic knowledge of AutoIt.

Also, since when did whole guilds farm for anything but GH vendors or allegiance? Ive got no doubt every individual keeps his gold to himself.

---

Quote:

If you notice, these PvE skills are not in Prophecies. The game changed between Proph and Factions. Factions, Nightfall and EotN did not carry any idealistic "skill > time" proclamations.

GW was always marketed as 'skill>time'. It wasn't always true, where getting the skill you needed to compete in GW:P endgame content (and yes, I do mean GvG) required massive amounts of time.

Plus, its BS to buy a game for a specific selling point, then have multiple expansions which drastically power creep the player base by participating in the very antithesis of that selling point.

---

Also, anyone who liked getting max Allegiance rank by hand should really try WoW. Be warned though, WoW's rep grinds are less repetitive then HFFF, and typically can be completed much quicker.

Dogmire · Jul 21, 2008, 01:40 PM // 13:40

Well I know that this is a dead horse but pvp title req was set way to high and the Allegiance title is no exception. You literally have to have no life what so ever just to get one pvp title maxed. FAIL

pumpkin pie · Jul 21, 2008, 01:45 PM // 13:45

Please don't do it. Go kill some luxon!

Issac · Jul 21, 2008, 03:06 PM // 15:06

Using a bot would be really really nice, but never ganna use one. But you could let it do all the grinding for you. Theirs 4 reputation, LB, SS 2 alliance titles. That's 8 titles it could do for you lol. That would be nice but oh well lol.

Accursed · Jul 21, 2008, 03:28 PM // 15:28

I wouldn't use macro's because their another name for a bot

SirSausage · Jul 21, 2008, 03:30 PM // 15:30

Yes, the dark side is tempting. But the consequences can be fatal (account ban). As for Anet not caring about HFFF botters, it's because them botters aren't doing any harm to the economy nor to other players.

legacyofkain85 · Sep 01, 2008, 06:31 PM // 18:31

im curious how to make a macro so that when u press a key your mouse cursor jumps to a coordinate on the screen or move to that coordinate

jamal555 · Sep 01, 2008, 06:52 PM // 18:52

if u dont know u dont need to know... 1 way less to make yourself banned...

if u are insane enough to do 300 hrs+ of kurzick fff or 600+ hrs for luxon u will learn to do it with your eyes closed in a month or so...

the only reasonable thing to do is give up before u start... save yourself of countless hours and days or repetetive farming for no purpose... if you break it down... 150g for a ~1:20 turnoover run is just crap... u can make more money/time in almost any other farm...

Rhamia Darigaz · Sep 01, 2008, 08:30 PM // 20:30

Quote:

Originally Posted by Esan

Look, it is a plain fact that there are HFFF bots in existence. A simple google search will reveal several versions.

We can take as a working hypothesis that a bot is identifiable by its behavior and responses to stimuli. The ones I have reported have all run to the Melandru's Hope marker (reachable by two "target next" actions from any of the Lutgardis spawn points), then spun around until the portal was in front of them, then run through them. To check if they indeed were bots, I sent them a personal message. None of them responded.

You see them doing it hour after hour for weeks on end, non stop, and it is clear that they can't be humans. Some of them even foolishly display a Savior of the Kurzicks title, and they are still botting away. The only reason can be to inflate the faction costs of towns, because there are faster ways to make money.

And if you report them, nothing happens. This has been going on since shortly after the release of nightfall, when HFFF was first formulated. Nothing has changed in a year.

that's all circumstantial evidence, really.
it isn't beyond reason that a player might use the target next action to move.
they might also be playing on a laptop without a mouse, so they use the rotate keys to turn around until they can move forward. even if they have a mouse, doing this isn't proof that they're a bot. it also isn't uncommon for a player to ignore private messages, especially when they're trying to hfff as fast as possible.
hfffing beyond kurzick r12 isn't proof that a person is botting at all. there are plenty of guilds whose goal is to own towns. just because a person in one of these guilds reaches r12 doesn't mean they aren't going to continue to contribute, and it certainly doesn't mean they're going to use a bot to do so.
i'd be disappointed is anet banned people based on this sort of speculation.

MercenaryKnight · Sep 01, 2008, 08:43 PM // 20:43

I think easiest way to not be considered a bot would be to actually walk to the zone everytime/ have someone to talk to while you do it. Because obviously bots would be pressing all the keys and stuff nonstop which would mean if you were typing to a friend you'd start seeing keys in your text from it attempting to hit a run skill.

Most people I see in lutgardis int all run to that one sign and then go to the left wall and hug it which looks quite easily to be a bot.

Feanixxx · Sep 01, 2008, 08:43 PM // 20:43

Quote:

Originally Posted by the_last_m_p

There really isn't any good way to discern botters from real people in HFFF.... due to the need for large map, my chat is hidden from me. Add to it, that the annoying sounds are muted (you try having the same sounds for hours on end), there is no way for me to detect a whisper.

So, by common bot-detection, am I a bot - I don't reply to whispers, and I keep on running out of the outpost all the time and don't see what is going on around me (again, big map)?

Above quote edited for conciseness.
I agree with this completely, when I HFFF I use Textmod for Hero markers with function key to place them. I can do a run in 50 seconds or so while watching a film on telly, repeating the behaviour over and over again - click on signpost, run to signpost, exit, set flags, run skills, get reward, all with chat off, sound off, cos I'm watching a film. I act and would be viewed exactly like a bot and surely reported by the more martinet posters in this thread

Thankfully I've stopped now

I wanted to grind from R4 to R7 to get 5 seconds of Save Yourselves but the recent change made it unnecessary and I'm not about to grind to R10 (a massive jump from R4) to get 6 seconds.

Monk Gsb · Sep 01, 2008, 09:47 PM // 21:47

do u guys ever check the dates of when a thread is 1st opened ?